Screen grab at takeoff

Screen grab at flight end

Screen grab at flight end：

This flight was conducted under the following conditions:

  

1. After power-up, the flight began with the Phantom 4’s battery charge at 100%

  

2. The Phantom 4’s “Obstacle Sensing System” function was switched off

  

3. The flight was made in “Attitude Mode," and the craft maintained a flight speed of less than 5 m/sec

  

4. The camera was not used for either still photos or to video-recording

  

5. The LED lights on the Phantom 4’s arms were turned off in “Advanced Settings"

The following screenshots show flight log data taken directly from the DJI GO app.

  

As much as I love the new bird I can't subscribe to your theory for getting the 28min run times this is totally impractical and not what users have bought into, today for first time after conditioning my batteries for 10 cycles I flew both my P3 and P4 back to back flights.
The P3 under moderate flight conditions gave me 15min of flight time and landed with 28% in the battery.
The P4 under the same conditions gave me 17min and landed with 27% in the battery.
I am totally impressed with this bird, but the battery is not living up to the hype , all my batteries are conditioned and none have flown below 50% for the first 10 flights and once conditioned I always aim to land with +- 30% left in the battery.

More than doubled your flight distance, lights on, VPS on, camera on, and flying at speeds up to 15m/s.
I truely expected the P4 to outshine the P3 in this department. (it barely matches it)
Give us a real world test, all the bells and whistles turned on, and fly it out at a reasonable speed as I have with the P3.
I'm not bashing, I thought your previous post on the P4 setup was absolutely great and I really do think this is an amazing bird, but together with praise we also have to admit fault and in this case I believe the battery is nowhere near the claimed performance.

Cheers
Rob

P.S note how much battery was left when I landed.

c'mon... Here he proves that under ideal conditions the battery gives the advertised flight time and even that isn't good enough. I'm really started to get enough of this forum where it's all about whining the loudest and never be happy with something.

No point in getting 28 minutes with everything OFF.  For me this test proves nothing.

P4 is made for filming/photo taking and if you cannot use the camera nor the advertised safety features and still get at least 25 minutes of one charge it is no good. Just flew this morning with all ON and got 20 minutes with battery alarm at 25% and conditions like:

- 10 mph wind
- 40 Fahrenheit temp
- 100% charge on battery (second charge)
- GPS most of the time
- Filming at 4K

I could have gotten 21 but 28 is not a reality.

He just proved the 28 is possible under ideal conditions and this is what DJi are advertising nothing else. If you want 30min I can sell you my hexa film rig but would be better off buying two P4 to get that flight time tbh ;)

frank@lokalhost Posted at 2016-3-26 23:21
c'mon... Here he proves that under ideal conditions the battery gives the advertised flight time and ...

Read my post I'm impressed with the bird ,not whining. Exactly how is turning off everything on the bird, even the camera and flying under 5m/s ideal conditions .
By the same token if I did the same with my P3 I might get close to 28min too, how is that an improvement on battery life. Quit looking for a reason to incite, at least provide a reasonable debate, what is at question here is whether the claimed improvements to the battery are fact!!.

Show me 28min with a P3 when doing that. I'm sorry but I've just been a member here for a few days and I'm already sick and tired of people looking for a reason to bash a awesome product even when there isn't anything wrong. Just like this case. It was NEVER stated by DJI that this will have 28min flight time every flight nomatter what. When people prove that 28min is possible under the conditions promised by dji that's not even good enough.

frank@lokalhost Posted at 2016-3-26 23:21
c'mon... Here he proves that under ideal conditions the battery gives the advertised flight time and ...

It's a forum and there will be many discussions, many you may not like or approve of and by the same token you have the right to not read or to move on.
Being rude doesn't cut it, so be polite and you might find you'll get a polite response.

Have a good day

frank@lokalhost Posted at 2016-3-27 01:32
Show me 28min with a P3 when doing that. I'm sorry but I've just been a member here for a few days a ...

I might just take you up on that one!,  how about a friendly wager.
I said get close to in my post, what would you consider close.
How about a public retraction for the looser

This is becoming a semantic war.  The test shows it can get 28 minutes under not just 'ideal" conditions but conditions no one would ever fly but for the purpose of the test.  It's kind of like the way car companies used to come up with MPG ratings on their cars before regulators, realizing it is deceptive, changed the rules to at least make the MPH possible in real world conditions.  I think a reasonable person would interpret the flight time as what is possible in good but still real-world flying conditions, not hovering the bird in ATTI mode just off the ground with video and even the LED lights off until the battery fails.  They are playing fast and loose with their definitions, just as many product companies have before them.  That's fine -- caveat emptor.  But let's not pretend it wasn't done to exaggerate the practical flying time for the average consumer.

I just made several hours with my Phantom 4 with even much more basic settings :
- no props
- no video
- max speed of 0m/s
- max height of 70cm (the heigth of my desk)

Finally had to turn off all this stuff as I fell asleep before battery was depleted

Rob_stal Posted at 2016-3-26 15:45
I might just take you up on that one!,  how about a friendly wager.
I said get close to in my post ...

I will be the first to admit I'm wrong if you pull off 28minutes + flight times on a p3 without any mod

The point however is that when will you guys ever be happy? If dji make a phantom 5 and says that it will have 40minutes flight time under ideal conditions and you get only 25-30 from regular flying you will still make a lot of noise on the forums. Look at the promised numbers from the P3 and look what most are pulling off and you will see that it also differs a lot. My car is also advertised with nice fuel consumption numbers but I never achieve those in normal conditions.

frank@lokalhost Posted at 2016-3-27 02:19
I will be the first to admit I'm wrong if you pull off 28minutes + flight times on a p3 without an ...

At no point did I say I expect 28min, I did expect a reasonable improvement over the P3 though. I didn't just start in the hobby, I have been flying for over 30years and know very well what to expect but given the leaps we have experienced in recent years with battery technology, when a manufacturer releases a new model claiming substantial improvements it is slightly disappointing to find that one of the preferred improvements is somewhat lacking in comparison to expectations.
You have come to this forum with a somewhat aggressive demeanour and have refused to read or acknowledge any previous replies other than to lambast and incite some form of written diatribe, I have been more than patient in replying and repeating back to you what has already been said in prior posts.
ONCE AGAIN 1: I think the P4 is an amazing piece of technology
                        2: I am well pleased with my purchase
                        3: It is one of the most stable bird I've ever flown
                        4: Take the time to read some of my posts I relation to the P4
                        5: DARE I SAY THAT THERE IS ONE ITEM I WOULD HAVE LOVED TO HAVE SEEN AN IMPROVEMENT ON   ------ THE BATTERY------ THIS IS NOT BASHING DJI .

Ulysse Posted at 2016-3-27 02:06
I just made several hours with my Phantom 4 with even much more basic settings :
- no props
- no vid ...

I'm going to tape it to the roof of a double deck bus, at least that way I get good consumption and altitude.{:3_48:}

Users questioned if 28min was possible under any conditions.  Yes under ideal conditions it is possible and we have demonstrated that.  When asked by users at events what the flight time is, I always quote a range of 23-28min as it depends on many factors.  The car milage analogy is appropriate.  Even after the regulators stepped in and standardized the tests, I don't know many owners that got the advertised milage.  I know on my new car it was about 15-25% off depending on conditions.  The P4's battery does provide longer flight times than the P3's.  That has been demonstrated by many users.  We are seeing a good 4-5mins longer in the real world.  That is an improvement.  It may not be what you wanted but a significant improvement.

citivas Posted at 2016-3-27 01:51
This is becoming a semantic war.  The test shows it can get 28 minutes under not just 'ideal" condit ...

Which if the manual stated 28min wouldn't you be happy with 22min real word.
P3 states 24min I get 17min landing @ 30%, I understand that and that's fair.
If 18min is all I'm going to get out the P4 so be it, all I said is that I expected a bit more as it was hyped up to be way better than the P3. (battery wise)
I think the bird is great and wouldn't trade it , but irrespective of how much praise I've given Dji for an excellent product, there is one individual here who is harping on about the battery comment and claiming I'm bashing Dji. (False I love the product)

Tahoe_Ed Posted at 2016-3-26 08:52
Users questioned if 28min was possible under any conditions.  Yes under ideal conditions it is possi ...

Can you describe "ideal conditions"? Does it include turning off the camera or collision avoidance? What speed should you fly? I would seriously like to replicate your results. I have started by conditioning my battery as recommended (down to 50% the first 10 cycles). My best time has been 21 minutes in a hover with CA off and not recording for one flight and flying flat out in P mode with everything on for another. The third time I try it, I will be flying at slower speeds with everything on. Part of the current angst is not knowing if we have bad batteries or are flying wrong or could be doing things differently to extend our flights. Once we all know everything, I think everyone will calm down.

Tahoe_Ed Posted at 2016-3-27 02:52
Users questioned if 28min was possible under any conditions.  Yes under ideal conditions it is possi ...

I never asked for 28min I am comparing the P4 to my P3 but it seems somehow this is getting lost in translation. There is a very defensive attitude in relation to any discussion that may question stated figures ( yes I know I won't get 28min) so I'll just keep on praising all the good things and well.........................
As for the 28min under any conditions test, really you're going to stand by that.............ok!!

Tahoe_Ed Posted at 2016-3-27 02:52
Users questioned if 28min was possible under any conditions.  Yes under ideal conditions it is possi ...

I don't see 4-5 min, that would make my flights 22-23min.
Not getting that.

Rob_stal Posted at 2016-3-26 16:35
At no point did I say I expect 28min, I did expect a reasonable improvement over the P3 though. I d ...

I'm sorry that my bad mood is let out on you also but this one guy making 4-5 threads on the same non-existant topic has gotten to me there I think

This thread started with a smart guy doing as DJI says and proves that it is possible to get 28minutes flight times (or actually over 28min). The first reply after is complaining about bad battery times and that its not a real world test (how more real can it get than flying in the real world?). Then you also say "to admit fault and in this case I believe the battery is nowhere near the claimed performance". Why should DJI admit any fault when he just proved that it is indeed possible to even exceed the flight time promised by DJI? They never said that this was the average flight time at all did they? If so then please excuse me and please link to that statement so I can read it.

I've seen many people reporting 22-24minutes flight times filming in P mode and to me that's not to far off. What baffles me tho is that people on this forum are really quick on the trigger on blaming DJI instead of looking into the problem. Look at the speed thread where the poser didn't even realise that he wasn't in sports mode himself before he made a video complaining about the low speed? Exactly the same thing there shooting first asking afterwards. I'll try to adopt into that style myself if that's the way it is around here but then I've totally missed the point of a community like this.

Tahoe_Ed Posted at 2016-3-27 02:52
Users questioned if 28min was possible under any conditions.  Yes under ideal conditions it is possi ...

I do love the bird as stated over and over, so lets just leave it at that.

frank@lokalhost Posted at 2016-3-27 03:10
I'm sorry that my bad mood is let out on you also but this one guy making 4-5 threads on the same  ...

What flight times are you getting on your P4?

Rob_stal Posted at 2016-3-27 00:10
I don't see 4-5 min, that would make my flights 22-23min.
Not getting that.

I am getting that at 6500' altitude and 40F temps.

frank@lokalhost Posted at 2016-3-27 03:10
I'm sorry that my bad mood is let out on you also but this one guy making 4-5 threads on the same  ...

I've defended Dji on many occasions in this forum, on one occasion I ask a question and ask for a more accurate test and all I get is someone without any knowledge of my commitment to the product both in and out of the forum mouthing off about how I'm bashing Dji,
An accurate test with all systems on would give me a benchmark with which to compare my equipment, I may have a poor battery, motor problem drawing too much current, but I'll never know that as the test is not real world - meaning what we would normally do with the bird, all systems on including camera.
That would give me a benchmark by which to compare my own times, even if they are only 18-20min at least they are realistic and a good comparison model, I will then know that is what I can expect and that my equipment is working as it should.

grangerfx@gmail Posted at 2016-3-26 23:59
Can you describe "ideal conditions"? Does it include turning off the camera or collision avoidance? ...

In Ca I got just over 25 minutes in a hover and that was all systems turned on.And in forward flight you will get more flight time.  Forward flight in ATTI mode.
And my battery on had a few charges on it, after 15-20 cycles, flight times will increase.

DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-3-27 03:31
In Ca I got just over 25 minutes in a hover and that was all systems turned on.
Due to transitiona ...

Thanks Ken, that sounds more realistic.
I would assume this would equate to close to 20-22 min flight time, but as I normally land @30% left in the battery I should expect a bit less?.
How much do you still have in the tank when you land.

DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-3-27 03:31
In Ca I got just over 25 minutes in a hover and that was all systems turned on.
And my battery on h ...

forgot to mention that I am @ 12 Cycles, so I may see improvement yet.
Thanks that helps

Tahoe_Ed Posted at 2016-3-27 03:30
I am getting that at 6500' altitude and 40F temps.

Sea level here and 32C, Ken has done a hover test which all be it simple is more relative to the conditions pilots here would relate to, in that all systems are active and most of us have spent time hovering about and should be able to estimate at how much more power we will consume flying around.

Rob_stal Posted at 2016-3-26 17:16
What flight times are you getting on your P4?

Haven't tested yet as I read to run at least 10 cycles with half discharge through my batteries before going low on them. It's been raining more or less constant here since I got mine so I have just a 7-8 flights on it yet. My longest flight was 14 minutes with 40% left until now but as I understand the "%" numbers doesn't give a good indication when the batteries are not calibrated yet (used down to 0% and rechared). I'm confident that it will be fine since so many are reporting decent numbers if batteries are handled correctly so if I don't get that myself It's most likely me doing something wrong.

Does anyone have more info on how the intelligent part of these batteries are working? Is there shunt resistor mounted in the batteries measuring the actual usage or is that just guesstimated by the software based on voltage, other parameters like stick input/altitude changes and flight times? How does this memory function really work on them? anyone slaughtered a battery yet and trying to figure out what's behind it so the best way of charging/discharging them can be determined. I've read what DJI tells you to do but often this is just the simplest solution to have the lowest amount of customer support and not necessary the best way to do it.

On my other rigs I use a combination of voltage, mAh and time to try to discharge about 80% of the total capacity (double checking with how many mAh I can charge them with) and this has worked out fine for years. I think I will try to do this with my phantom also even if I have to rely on the discharge showed in the OSD since there is no monitoring of the amount I charge it with. Open to suggestions on how to do this if anyone have better ways of doing it.

Rob_stal Posted at 2016-3-27 00:35
Thanks Ken, that sounds more realistic.
I would assume this would equate to close to 20-22 min fli ...

I have not done a battery endurance test yet in forward flight but many have and achieved the 28 minutes.
Hovering exerts more energy than forward flight due to translational lift. Also when the 4 forces of flight are in equilibrium thats when you are going to be the most efficient. In a helicopter is 20-25mph or so, I have no idea what is on the P4. Probably 10-15mph and in ATTI mode. Also, being at sea level is going to give you bette results then at high altitude.
So after your battery has been conditioned (15-20 cycles) and only using 50% for the first 10 cycles I think you can achieve the advertised time.
So try all that then report.
And to add about the can manufactures MPG specs, those are also in ideal conditions.
So if you are alone in your car and drive 55 on the freeway level ground with no winds and air conditioning turned off, you will get the advertised MPG.

Rob_stal Posted at 2016-3-26 17:35
At no point did I say I expect 28min, I did expect a reasonable improvement over the P3 though. I d ...

MA COME FAI A DIRE CHE E IL MEGLIO CHE HAI VOLATO? IO HO ASPETTATO CON ENTUSIASMO IL MIO PHANTOM 4 MA DOPO AVERLO PROVATO LA DELUSIONE E STATA GRANDE TEMPO VOLO STABILITA RIPRESE CON ORIZZONTE INCLINATO SONO SOLO ALCUNE COSE CHE NON VANNO MOLTO MOLTO MEGLIO PHANTOM 3

Rob_stal Posted at 2016-3-26 18:31
I've defended Dji on many occasions in this forum, on one occasion I ask a question and ask for a m ...

HAI RAGIONE TEMPO VOLO 18 MINUTI  MA A PARTE IL TEMPO IL MIO PHANTOM 4 HA MOLTI PROBLEMI I PIU GRAVI SONO POCA STABILITA RIPRESE VIDEO CON ORIZZONTE INCLINATO  INCREDIBILE DJI FATTO LAVORO APPROSSIMATIVO SONO MOLTO DELUSO[url][/url]

imm.arcobaleno Posted at 2016-3-27 18:53
HAI RAGIONE TEMPO VOLO 18 MINUTI  MA A PARTE IL TEMPO IL MIO PHANTOM 4 HA MOLTI PROBLEMI I PIU GRA ...

Non vogliono che si lamentano, la prima volta ho mai messo in discussione qualcosa e uno dei moderatori salta dritto con una risposta parziale.
Non in buona forma, considerando che il forum è lì per risolvere e parlare di questioni.
Ho 12 spese sulla mia batteria, ho intenzione di volare ancora oggi e speriamo che vedo qualche miglioramento, come di ancora non sono in grado di stabilire se la batteria è in colpa o che richiede ulteriori spese solo il tempo dirà.

Applausi e Roberto volo sicuro

Guys it's 28min at 25degrees outside, don't underestimate temperature!

Looking at the OPs battery usage, for each 5 minutes of flight time he used 17%, 18%, 19%, 19%, and 20%. leaving him at 7% remaining 25 minutes into the flight.  Very consistent.  But, that last 7% lasted another 3 minutes+.  It seems like there is a bit of cushion built into the battery remaining percentage, somewhere between 1 and 2 minutes of flight time.

DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-3-26 13:28
I have not done a battery endurance test yet in forward flight but many have and achieved the 28 mi ...

It would be interesting to know what flight speed is the most energy efficient, for those situations where you're trying to get home on a low battery.