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Sweden bans cameras on drones
2673 32 2016-10-25
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aaron.ferguson
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No Mavic sales in Sweden!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-37761872


2016-10-25
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bmallory
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Why? I suppose they already have laws against privacy invasion, and if you're a criminal I suppose you weren't going to follow the law anyway...
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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bmallory@gmail. Posted at 2016-10-25 19:10
Why? I suppose they already have laws against privacy invasion, and if you're a criminal I suppose y ...

The Swedish Supreme court was asked to come with a verdict on a case and the result of this was that it's no longer OK to fly drones with an attached camera since it's "surveillance" according to an outdate law from 1977 long before the drones were invented. It's a huge blow mostly for the professional people that use the tool for work.

The government also have an ongoing study about this law and the result from that one will be presented summer 2017 meanwhile we are grounded.

I seriously don't think that the law enforcment will spend so much time and effort chasing a drone pilot though if there is not very obvious that some one is breaking the law.

Sad new anyways.
2016-10-25
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hallmark007
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There is a two page thread already here about this, but I suppose it's better than another thread about Mavic Combo. Lol
2016-10-25
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kevinljxljx
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Tip: the author has been banned or deleted automatically shield
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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hallmark007 Posted at 2016-10-25 19:25
There is a two page thread already here about this, but I suppose it's better than another thread ab ...

I know saw that one some days ago, but there is so much talk about delivered or not which is funny in its on way somehow
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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kevinljxljx Posted at 2016-10-25 19:31
Did they say you can still fly it as long as you apply for a permit which cost $$?

yes you can apply for a permit for 370 € approx but you have to prevent crimes or doing some good stuff for getting it. Ie don't even bother to apply.

The discussion in Sweden in forums similar to this is basically pointing in the direction that crimes will rise from now on.

I personally don't have anything against some regulations and the people are respectfull and use common sense but this was to much. I'm happy that I can go to other places in Europe that are more liberal than we currently seem to be in Sweden.
2016-10-25
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DJI-Ken
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Flybee Posted at 2016-10-26 01:39
yes you can apply for a permit for 370 € approx but you have to prevent crimes or doing some good ...

I'm sorry your unable to fly legally now.
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-10-25 19:40
I'm sorry your unable to fly legally now.

Thanks Ken.

We can fly, but not with something with a camera attached. BTW can you fly "normally" with out the Memory card in a Mavic (just for practising flying) I'm so fortunate so I travel around in Europe a lot which means that I can go "live" when i'm abroad.

At the moment it don't makes any difference it we get deliveries or not but it will change I'm sure about it.
2016-10-25
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70challenger
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Could you take the camera off or tape the lens for now and maybe the tape will blow off by the wind?
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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70challenger Posted at 2016-10-25 19:45
Could you take the camera off or tape the lens for now and maybe the tape will blow off by the wind? ...

Sounds like a good idea
2016-10-25
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msduncanrolltid
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Sounds like it's time to clean house on politicians in Sweden.  
2016-10-25
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DJI-Ken
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Flybee Posted at 2016-10-26 01:43
Thanks Ken.

We can fly, but not with something with a camera attached. BTW can you fly "normally" ...

Correct, you can Livestream your video feed to Social Media, but make sure you're even allowed to do that.
2016-10-25
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hallmark007
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Flybee Posted at 2016-10-25 18:35
I know saw that one some days ago, but there is so much talk about delivered or not which is funny ...

Yes your right, Sweden is a place I visit four or five times a year, my daughter lives in upsala, was hoping to bring my Mavic, so hopefully they'll get it together.
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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msduncanrolltid Posted at 2016-10-25 19:48
Sounds like it's time to clean house on politicians in Sweden.

Ha ha, yes that might be the fact but in other cases but this it's not a political issue. More that the laws have not been updated accordingly which the politicans have asked for an update so they are acting, I don't how fast but.....

Can we borrow one of your presidential candidates for a while, that would be funny to see what he would do
2016-10-25
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T_A_Rogers
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Flybee Posted at 2016-10-26 01:18
The Swedish Supreme court was asked to come with a verdict on a case and the result of this was th ...

How does Swedish legal code define "surveillance"?

We have a similar law in Texas (a full analysis of it here) but you're generally safe as long as you aren't "useing an unmanned aircraft to capture an image of an individual or privately owned real property in this state with the intent to conduct surveillance on the individual or property captured in the image”. Aerial photography is not the same as surveillance by most definitions.
2016-10-25
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bmallory
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Flybee Posted at 2016-10-25 19:52
Ha ha, yes that might be the fact but in other cases but this it's not a political issue. More tha ...

that is what I was about to say... If it's a ruling and not a new law, it's understandable...

Next year in France you'll have to register and put a s**t ton of flight limiting features on anything that weigh more than 800g. My already-illegal fpv skywalker is "more illegal" each day. There's also a diffrence between flying illegally and flying responsibly... I don't think I put anyone in danger when I'm doing this :
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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bmallory@gmail. Posted at 2016-10-25 20:05
that is what I was about to say... If it's a ruling and not a new law, it's understandable...

Nex ...

could't agree more, about the difference.

Some organisation have already written some complaints to some EU office and asked why Sweden is an exception to other regulation/laws in comparison with a lot of contries in the Union.
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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T_A_Rogers Posted at 2016-10-25 20:05
How does Swedish legal code define "surveillance"?

We have a similar law in Texas (a full analys ...

Well I wish I could give you a clear answer on this one, I will try to give you what I have understood so far.

There are two things that the court uses as arguments:

1. Steadily attached to a flying vehicle
2. Can not be operated on spot.

The drones are fulfilling these two things and that is a strong violation of the personal integrity the court ruled.

To get a permit for flying you must prevent a crime

You need to have an approval from ALL identifiable persons/property on photos/footage on cameras that are "steadily" mounted on a Flying vehicle. It's OK to do it  if you have a camera in a car, on a bike and so forth, the interpretation here is that if you are on a road you should be expecting that you are watched. When you are in your back yard you should not be watched.

So the main thing about this old law which most people are reacting on now is that the camera is "steadily" attached for survailance

There is a lot of discussions (I'm coming from "Normal" photography world) about the comparison about street photography, why are we allowed to take photos on people with a hand held camera? We can most definitely identify those people, but the difference is that the hand held camera is not Steadily mounted/attached.



I sell some photos to stock agencies and in this case we have much more liberal laws in Sweden (Scandinavia) then rest of Europe, USA for some reason and here we go in a total different direction.

I hope it was some kind of explanation
2016-10-25
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Schloff
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You be gutted if you've preordered on and this happens.
2016-10-25
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Mpampis
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Buy the Mavic and take off the camera ;-p, I'm kidding! But how about if you flying the drone in a non crowded place?
2016-10-25
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Ange1walk
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The problem is very simple to explain why Swedens Court decided to do this:

The problem in General with Politics and Technology is, you only see 60 year old Fu**s work and they have absolutely no clue what they are talking about, or they are about to do and just do something, so people can say "Hey these politicians do something".
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-10-25 19:49
Correct, you can Livestream your video feed to Social Media, but make sure you're even allowed to d ...

Aha very good to know.

Thanks Ken
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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hallmark007 Posted at 2016-10-25 19:51
Yes your right, Sweden is a place I visit four or five times a year, my daughter lives in upsala,  ...

Aha, well there are some great places around Uppsala where I think you can be undisturbed. For heavens sake do not go to Arlanda (Airport) but I guess you already know that.
2016-10-25
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DJI-Ken
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Flybee Posted at 2016-10-26 05:31
Aha very good to know.

Thanks Ken

No problem at all.
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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Mpampis Posted at 2016-10-25 23:09
Buy the Mavic and take off the camera ;-p, I'm kidding! But how about if you flying the drone in a n ...

Nope, not even then but as I see you are from Germany I wonder how the regulations are there since I spend a lot of time in Bayern. Is it ok to fly there? I have reed some general rules of course flight height and so forth, but is it more things that one should know and be aware of?

In Sweden we have a lot of places where there most certainly are not crowed so I guess this places will be crowded anyways in the future.
2016-10-25
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Flybee
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Ange1walk Posted at 2016-10-25 23:15
The problem is very simple to explain why Swedens Court decided to do this:

The problem in General  ...

Yes I think you are right here. There is always two sides of a coin. Used to be a biker in my younger years and back then we always said that there are two kinds of people, the ones that rides bikes and these guys that have to watch other ride.

So there is a lot of people here that are more then happy and then the rest of us is totally upset about this. We are in minority I would say.

Hopefully this ongoing investigation that the guverment has asked for will have some good result in the end.
2016-10-25
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hallmark007
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Flybee Posted at 2016-10-25 22:32
Aha, well there are some great places around Uppsala where I think you can be undisturbed. For heav ...

I know some lovely spots to film , always wanted to bring my P4 but to much hassle, so Mavic is ideal, hopefully they won't arrest me, and will be well clear of Arlanda, cheers..
2016-10-25
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nicke
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Loophole in the Swedish drone photo ban makes it even more bizzar.{:4_142:}

Article in Swedish

"The new photo ban does not apply to all the drones inside the borders of Sweden. For companies in other EU countries are free to continue shooting in Sweden, Di Digital can reveal.

A new decision of the Supreme Administrative Court has created great outrage among Swedish drone companies. The decision requires the Swedish drone companies subject to the so-called surveillance law. That means they need the same permits security cameras to get the photograph in a public place. It is to avoid privacy violations.

The decision, Di Digital reported earlier, hitting hard against an industry that employs thousands of people in Sweden and is worth billions, according to industry organization UAS Sweden.

But the rules do not apply to all the drones shoot in Sweden, Di Digital can reveal. For drönarbolag based in other EU countries, it remains free to shoot in Sweden.

Data Inspection Unit Nicklas Hjertonsson confirms that it is so provisions should be interpreted. According to him, the law applies to surveillance only Swedish companies, companies registered outside the EU, and EU companies which have a branch or otherwise established in Sweden.

"Are there cameras used here in Sweden, for example, drones, and conducting monitoring is established in Sweden, as regards surveillance law. But is there anyone who is established in another EU country, then applies the rules of the country, "says Nicklas Hjertonsson.

The loophole arises because the camera surveillance law is based on an EU directive. All EU countries are required to comply with the directive, to a certain level, but then it is up to each country how far they want to take their own laws.

It sounds absurd that there should be so much difference between our team and the other EU countries.
"It may sound strange to someone who operates in Sweden should follow the example German law. But as it is, each EU country should take responsibility for those who are established in each country, "says Nicklas Hjertonsson.

While the new law allows for the Drone companies based in another country to take photo assignments in Sweden, so the authorities will make a decision in each case.
But if the company has a branch or built up structure in Sweden is considered to be established here, and these must follow Swedish law."

Nice way of killing of Swedish companies and at the same time invite foreign companies to take the job instead!!! {:4_177:}
2016-10-27
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kevinelliott
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hallmark007 Posted at 2016-10-26 01:51
Yes your right, Sweden is a place I visit four or five times a year, my daughter lives in upsala,  ...

I have been going to Sweden once a year. Heading there Nov 18-28 this year. Pretty bummed I won't be taking the drones!
2016-10-27
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hallmark007
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kevinelliott Posted at 2016-10-27 13:43
I have been going to Sweden once a year. Heading there Nov 18-28 this year. Pretty bummed I won't  ...

Is that because of the law or because you won't have your Mavic, I was on to dji this morning by email, I purchased 29th, they told me could be up to three weeks, I had previously spoke to them and was told it would ship early November , seems to be getting pushed out further everyday..
2016-10-27
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msduncanrolltid
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Flybee Posted at 2016-10-25 12:52
Ha ha, yes that might be the fact but in other cases but this it's not a political issue. More tha ...

You can take them both.   Please.
2016-10-27
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kevinelliott
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hallmark007 Posted at 2016-10-27 22:01
Is that because of the law or because you won't have your Mavic, I was on to dji this morning by e ...

Both reasons. I ordered 29th like you. So who knows if I'll even have it. And if I do, sounds like people will be staring at me wondering why I'm flying and that worries me.
2016-10-27
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